18: Ep. 18 | Navigating Mentorship in Tech Internships with Alec Breton, Cole Hartman, and Doris Wang

Erika (00:00) Welcome to the Overcommitted Podcast where we discuss our code commits, our personal commitments, and some stuff in between. I’m your host today, Erica. Joined by…

Bethany (00:09) Hey, I’m Bethany.

Brittany Ellich (00:10) and I’m Brittany Ellich

Erika (00:11) you

We are software engineers who initially met as a new hire group at GitHub and found a common interest in continuous learning and building interesting projects. We continue to meet to share our learning experiences and discuss our lives as developers. Whether you’re pushing code or taking on new challenges, we are happy you’re listening. This week, we are diving into the crucial topic of mentorship, specifically within the context of a GitHub subber internship. We’ll explore what defines a successful internship from ever

perspective as well as the technical aspects of mentorship and the vital role of psychological safety and building trust in a mentor-mentee relationship. Plus, we’ll share some unconventional advice for aspiring interns and mentors.

We are thrilled to welcome our special guests who have had real life experience in this area and have generously agreed to share it with us. Welcome to Alec, Doris and Cole. Would you like to introduce yourselves?

Alec (01:10) Sure, I can start. I’m Alec. I’m a senior software engineer on the app team here at GitHub. And yeah.

Doris Wang (01:17) Hi everyone, I’m Doris. I’m a student at Carnegie Mellon going into my senior year studying CS and I’m a summer intern on the apps team.

Cole (01:27) Hi everybody, I’m Cole. I’m a rising senior at Cal State Long Beach studying CS and I’m also a GitHub summer intern on the App Steam.

Erika (01:35) So welcome to the podcast. So glad you’re here. So let’s start with the definition of success. What, from each of your perspectives, defines a successful internship? Not only from your perspective, but how you see your stakeholders also view it.

Doris Wang (01:54) So I think like, from my perspective, a successful internship is something, is an experience where I’ve like learned a lot and also feel like I’ve contributed a lot to like the team itself. Not that I’ve just like worked on a project, but that my project has impact like on the team and just like on the product for the company. So yeah, just like.

having a lot of impact and getting a lot out of my experience.

Cole (02:25) Yeah, I can add onto that a little bit. I definitely like that point having tangible value definitely feels more impactful through your work. And I think looking from the team, what success looks like for interns is where everybody succeeds and everybody’s able to collaborate in a work environment where we feel comfortable to grow as engineers and also ask questions without the fear of failure or criticism.

I think everybody just wants the interns to feel successful at the end. And for us, that definitely looks like having a lot of tangible value, getting a lot of good feedback and bad feedback so we can improve our product. And for me personally, I think that finishing all my work is also a big contribution to my satisfaction at the end.

Bethany (03:11) I’m curious, how do you, through your internship, how are you measuring this impact? Is it something you’re tracking through how many issues you do or how much progress you make towards a bigger project? What are you doing to kind of measure that?

Cole (03:28) Yeah, that’s something we’re actively looking into. One part of it is we can actually see metrics on how many personal access tokens are being created. So if that number goes up, that’s generally a good thing. We also staff chipped our feature recently. So we’re able to get a lot of feedback from people in our QA and improvements. And we also have our PM who’s reaching out to other areas and asking for feedback on this feature that we’re working on.

we can kind of just congregate all of that and get a good estimate of how much impact we’re having.

Doris Wang (03:58) Another big part of that is like mindset. feel like knowing like when to ask questions and like feeling comfortable asking questions is like an area of growth that like measures.

Success, I guess, and then like just like learning how to be a good developer. I feel like I’m much more comfortable like going into the code base and like making changes by myself and I see that as like a huge success. And just like learning the developer cycle like as someone early in career is like. I think the biggest success for sure.

Bethany (04:27) That’s awesome to understand it from both the personal side and the also like external side of ⁓ what value are you providing, but not only that, what value you’re getting. I realized too before maybe we go on, should we talk about how this internship is structured? Just to clarify to listeners what you’re doing for the summer.

And just to clarify to listeners how the internship is structured and what interns are expected for the summer and what they’re expected to gain, it sounds like you all are doing a single project and then trying to ship an actual feature, but we’d love to maybe give folks some more knowledge around that.

Alec (05:04) Sure, yeah. So from the company perspective, I think the main goal of the internship is to give hands-on experience to engineering interns, like getting their hands dirty and making sure they’re learning, making an impact. From the apps team perspective, we were specifically working on a page within settings, kind of revamping that. It’s been in much need of an uplift recently. I think Colin Doris,

added some really good points just now and it’s been a great summer. Something that I think is interesting though, from my perspective, just to answer the question of like what makes it a successful internship is from my perspective personally, not necessarily that the project gets done. I think that’s the ultimate goal is like we’re able to deliver something and say, hey, we got this done. But I would say

What makes it most successful is making sure that the interns feel like they’re integrated into the team, that they’ve learned and they’ve been able to push code. Like that’s it from the engineering perspective. I think that’s the most important part because sometimes projects don’t get done on time. Like that’s the real world. Sometimes deadlines get pushed out, but it doesn’t mean it wasn’t successful. So that’s like an interesting thing that.

It’s potentially debatable. I I don’t make the rules. Like maybe there’s someone making rules above me saying, no, that is a failure. But if I was the CEO, I would say it’s still a successful internship, like regardless of actually rolling something out, like right then and there. But yeah, sorry, that was a long answer, but I just wanted to answer that as well.

Brittany Ellich (06:38) Yeah, that sounds great. Can we talk a little bit about mentoring as part of an internship and specifically the hands-on mentoring with relatively new developers and what that looks like in the intern program? Are you doing a lot of pairing? Are you helping people get up to speed? What does that sort of look like?

Alec (06:58) Yeah, that’s a good question. Because I would say it really depends on the project. And then also, I think the dynamic really changes between who the engineers are. In my career, I have a lot of experience with pair programming. And what I noticed was every single pair had their own dynamic, which was like really a nice thing because you know that if you change your pair, like

different days, you’re going to have a different experience. And I think that’s kind of the beauty of the internship as well. Like each intern, Colin Doris and myself, I think we bring different things to the table. And I think that’s important to remember in the mentorship process. It’s like we all have our own personalities and ways of doing things.

And I think that also creates a successful mentor relationship is like understanding our different strong suits and weaknesses and like how we like to get things done. So that’s like really important first things first. And then also just really listening to like.

If there’s an issue in the code, listening to the interns, ⁓ we have a quick sync every day this summer, which I actually think was a great addition because it gave us a chance to not only talk about the code and fix problems on a daily basis, but we also got to know each other on a more personal level, which I think really helped the progress of the project even.

⁓ Like it wasn’t just business all the time. I think like having that friendly nature about us kind of helped things. But I’ll let Doris and Gold talk more about that. But that’s just my perspective on the summer so far.

Cole (08:34) yeah, I guess adding on to kind of how Alec has been mentoring us, think definitely his mentorship as a big contribution to our success. And I think one of the things that he did a very good job of was introducing us to the code base at the beginning. Cause I think that’s one of the most daunting things initially is figuring out what to do and where to go.

and how things work. So he did a very good job at helping us through that and guiding us. But I’d also like to say that it’s kind of a two-way relationship because being a good mentee is also important, knowing when to ask questions and kind of what questions to ask, and also being willing to be in a learning mindset and…

For example, you know, show up to these weekly syncs and communicate our project and our progress to ALEC is very important and definitely contributes to the success of the mentorship relationship.

Erika (09:27) Am I right in understanding to you that it was a completely new stock for both of you? You were working in React and Rails and those were both new?

Doris Wang (09:38) Yeah, just.

Erika (09:38) There’s all.

Alec (09:38) Not just

that, was amazed. Correct me if I’m wrong, but it felt like neither of you had touched a line of web design code before, but coming to, at least from a React perspective, for coming to GitHub. I think you might have had some experience, but never pushing professionally to a code base, which is amazing. But yeah.

Erika (09:58) Yeah, that’s a lot to learn in a short amount of time between the technical onboarding and all the process. Yeah, so definitely kudos to getting up to speed on all that.

Cole (10:11) I’d say if anyone’s curious what the hardest thing to learn was, I’d definitely say Rails. Rails was very hard for me to learn. took a long time.

Brittany Ellich (10:19) I agree. Valid.

Bethany (10:20) I feel like I’m still learning Rails. So kudos to you for picking up that. Absolutely.

Brittany Ellich (10:22) Yeah. Nice word.

Cole (10:24) You never stop.

Yeah, you never stop learning. ⁓

Brittany Ellich (10:28) What’s helpful to… sorry, go ahead.

Erika (10:28) Yeah,

I was going to say, I laugh because the whole point of Rails is to give you of sane defaults. literally none of them made sense to me until I looked at the source code, which completely takes the point away of having sane defaults if you’re like, no, but this doesn’t make sense unless I actually know what it’s doing behind the scenes.

Stop is how I feel.

Brittany Ellich (10:56) I’m curious though for both Doris and Cole, what has been the most helpful thing for you learning this and getting up to speed and pushing code all within this short amount of time? What has been the most helpful thing from your mentor as you’re doing that?

Doris Wang (11:09) ⁓ I think really helping us understand context and especially towards the beginning when we were fresh to the code base, helping us get up to speed and really giving us that context and his experience working with the code base, I think that helped kind of pave the way for us being comfortable to break off on our own and like…

you know, not depending on Alec all the time, like, with making changes. So, I think that’s a big thing. I also think that, like, Alec is just, like, kind of always there for us, like, if we need any help. Now that we’re more comfortable, a lot of times, like, during our daily syncs, it’s more like advice on how do we, like, we have our own idea of how to implement this, or we have some solution, like, what’s Alec’s advice on

like our idea. So I think it’s like really transformed into like

Now he’s like kind of more on the side like assisting us and like in the beginning him like really guiding us. That was super, super helpful. And then like knowing when to be a little bit more hands off and like letting us like kind of take ownership and responsibility. But then also like providing feedback and advice. Like that is, that has been like really instrumental to our success and like just how we feel about this whole internship.

Cole (12:30) Yeah, I definitely agree. think I really liked the transition of us kind of becoming more independent in our work and venturing off on our own. that was a really, I think we handled that really well as a team and we kind of very slowly and gradually entered that stage. But also another thing that

know, Al kind of did besides helping us understand the code base was helping us understand what even FGPADs are and how organizations and enterprises interact and work together. Because I think it’s very good to understand the product before you even look at the code base. So that’s a very important and I feel like often overlooked aspect of it.

Erika (13:05) Well…

Something you were talking about earlier, Alec, made me like brought to mind some pairing sessions where, you know, like I’ve had experiences that have been really positive and then I’ve had some that I found mildly traumatizing. And this segues us into the topic of psychological safety and sort of highlighting that it definitely does not come for free. It’s not a given.

in

all development environments. So what were some of the ways that you all established? Maybe I’ll start with you, Alec, like how you promoted psychological safety within like your relationship with Doris and Cole. Yeah, how you set the standard and then sort of maintained that throughout the summer.

Alec (13:52) Yeah, that’s a good question. Because I think psychological safety is very important. And it’s funny, you don’t realize how important it is until you don’t have it. And I’ve definitely had environments like that where I didn’t feel the safety as much. It makes you like really want it. So.

I think number one for me, having had that experience, I try to foster those types of environments in some ways in which I try to do that. And I want Doris and Cole to keep me honest here too, because like, if I didn’t do it, like I want them to vouch for me on this, because I don’t want to just say, I did all these things, ⁓ because they’re really the testament to.

how well I did as a mentor. I can’t just say, I did a great job. But I think first and foremost, I like to make sure we’re in a good spot. Like if we get to the end of our materials, for instance, during our daily quick sinks, and maybe, you know, we have some time left over, I’ll just kind of ask like, how are we feeling or

Honestly, like right away too. I’ll just start with the question like, how’s it going? I think we’ve gotten to a point now where I’m like, the time is yours. Like, let me know. Like how you’re feeling. I think it’s also a gradual process too, to like provide psychological safe safety because there is also an element of like the interns feeling okay to share things. like you can tell them it’s okay, but.

⁓ it’s really how the situation develops when they need to share something, and how you react to it. So, I would say I tried to like foster an environment where it was okay to like share your thoughts, but, I will let them say otherwise if that’s not true, but yeah.

Cole (15:38) Yeah, that’s definitely true. And I definitely want to point out the fact that you always ask us how we’re feeling, not just on the project, but in general. And if we wanted to further talk about it, would spend the entire sync just talking about that. So we felt very cared for. And I think this definitely boils down to kind of relationships.

those can look very different in a workplace environment depending on the types of people, the job, the team. So in our situation, I think me and Doris definitely formed like some sort of a friendship with Alec, which made everything very easy and smooth. But, you know, that’s just for our situation that might not be the most comfortable for other teams in other situations. So it’s definitely just about the dynamic.

and how you choose to form it over time. But I think what’s most important is being conscious and advocating for that most comfortable environment for everybody.

Doris Wang (16:28) Yeah, I definitely agree. And I want to add on, like, I think Alec did a really good job, like, in the first, like, week or two of our internship, like, kind of breaking the ice. And, like, I think it’s, like, a little bit difficult for, and I to, like, just start sharing our personal lives. But I think, like, Alec, like, kind of started sharing, like, what his life is like. And then that, like, just made everything, like, very human, I guess. It wasn’t just, a professional relationship. And I think that helped build trust.

a lot and like as Cole said, like we almost have like a little bit like of a friend dynamic as well, like when we do our sinks. And I think another like another like building trust area that Alec did really well was like being really open to feedback. think like.

He kind of challenges us to challenge his ideas sometimes, and I feel unafraid to give feedback on his ideas. I think that back and forth, he’s really fostered that environment to be able to have us be comfortable with that back and forth. And I think that also contributes a lot to our learning. So shout out to Alec. You’ve been a great mentor.

Bethany (17:38) That is awesome. I think it’s so important in psychology, like to implement psychological safety and just for the success of the team to make sure that everybody, their voices are heard and their opinions matter. So that’s awesome that you all had figured out how to really give that feedback and bounce things off each other. That’s awesome.

So in our podcast, we talk a lot about AI. It’s a very much hot topic. So I am really curious just hearing from the perspective of Cole and Doris, people who are very early in career, like…

like continuing to learn, how do you balance using AI to go faster or learn more versus actually ingesting that knowledge? What are your strategies for that and how do you balance that?

Cole (18:23) I could go first. Yeah, great question. I guess my approach to utilizing AI when I’m coding is using it as a tool to understand the code and what it’s doing already because the main job of a software developer that you realize once you become an intern or full time at a bigger company is that most of your job is to just understand what’s already happening and to kind of reuse or change that logic there or somewhere else. So.

There’s a lot of context that AI can help you understand. And I think it’s also just good for redundant things. I don’t know, rewriting a block of code or just redundant things in the code that you need to do. That can definitely help you with that. But obviously it can be a crutch if you use it to the extent where you tell it to do the work for you. And then you don’t take the extra step to understand what it did. And

I mean, the age-old story is that it just keeps writing worse and worse code and you get farther and farther away from the solution and you have to spend more time debugging it than you would have if you sell it on your own. So it’s all about the balance, really.

Doris Wang (19:22) Yeah, I totally agree with what Colt said. I think I use it a lot in understanding context just because we are so new to web dev and also just this new code base. And also because especially this is my first experience with web dev, I don’t know the syntax of a lot of stuff. I don’t really know the structure of some of these things. But I know the solution in my mind. I just don’t know how to implement

like in the language or like in this like framework. So I will use like AI a lot of times to like help me write stuff like in the way that I want it to I guess because I just like am not fluent in like Ruby or like JavaScript. So I think that’s been really helpful like yeah. So like balancing kind of like critical thinking and problem solving like.

by myself and then using AI as a tool to help me express my solutions and actually code it up. I think having it to understand context, using Co-Pilot to really understand context has been a huge time saver. also from ⁓ Alex’s side, we need to reach out to him less to like…

understand the code base which I think is like also really good but yeah definitely knowing like how much to rely on AI and like making sure that you’re not like super reliant and making sure that you know how to like go back and like look at the response and like know what’s wrong with it if anything is super important so definitely like yeah as Cole said finding that balance is really important.

Bethany (20:58) That’s awesome. That makes a lot of sense. I remember as an intern, I was, it was a little jarring going to a private space where in classes you could Google most anything because most things were very transitive and available on the public internet. And then going into a private business, you’re like, I can’t Google what is this thing because no one will know. So AI is almost like a search engine for your own code, which is awesome. That’s really cool.

and I love that you all are really thinking about how to balance it helping you but not doing the work for you or taking away those opportunities for you to learn. That’s really cool. All right. yeah.

Cole (21:39) Yeah. Oh,

sorry. If you don’t mind me bringing it up, I’ve never asked Alec how he uses AI because, you know, me and Doris are the new generation of programmers. So I feel like we’re both kind of on the same page about how to use Copilot and AI and whatnot. So I’m actually very in the dark about how Alec uses it. So I’m very curious.

Alec (21:56) put me on the spot? No, I actually, that’s a good question because I was just thinking about what my internship was like a long time ago, like, and how it would have changed what I was doing. And I think it’s not, it’s not too far off from even when I was an intern because the way in which I develop is still like,

diving into code, seeing how it works, learning from it. And it’s the same way now than when I started my career. I think it’s just I’ve built certain skill sets that allow me to do things quicker. So I think I use AI very similarly in that.

I use it when I’m not sure about something. And that’s always going to happen in your career. Like no matter what, you’re not going to know everything. It’s just maybe there are less moments that I need to use it. So I might use it in the same ways that both of you do just less often. So yeah, I think an amazing part of AI lately, and I could talk about this for an hour, but like

Just the way in which AI has caused me not to worry about some code is crazy. Like unit testing is like used to be this whole thing. It used to take me like a day to like write tests for a component, but now you can write tests in like a half an hour and it’s crazy. or like I’d be blocked on something for a day. And I have not felt that way since AI like has been really used.

I haven’t been that blocked since before AI and I think that’s crazy. So yeah, I don’t know if anyone else feels similarly about AI, but that’s been pretty crazy with my experience.

Bethany (23:39) Absolutely. I agree. I think it’s like chatting with somebody who has…

and the knowledge of your specific case and you’re able to kind of brainstorm more easily with even if it’s like rubber ducking but with kind of an automated interface rather than a person for better or for worse. But it’s been very helpful for saying, okay, well, this is how I’m thinking about this but are there other ways to implement it? Is there other things I can do like would this have performance implications? Am I missing something about this code?

really cool. Awesome.

Erika (24:09) Yeah,

I think it’s cool that we’re talking about this after we talk about some of the team building dynamics and interpersonal relationships too, because I think that’s something that’s not mentioned in the topic of AI usage, but is something that could also potentially be lost is those discussions of brainstorming and really connecting with people.

people kind of talk about like, I have me and my AI and that’s all I need. You know, it’s like, well, no, if you’re working on a team, you do need those other people on your team. Like you do need to still build those relationships. yeah, without.

even mentioning it in what you said, like you’ve clearly also struck a balance between, like using the AI to like help rubber duck or solve problems and also still like, it sounds like you’ve found some kind of line of like, okay, but now I’m going to still like go to the team or go to, you know, Alec with these questions that like AI can’t answer. And that’s an opportunity to build relationships and opportunity to, build knowledge.

Bethany (25:12) That is such a great point. Asking questions is a huge skill, and I’m sure AI makes it easy to ask the questions to the AI, but you still need to develop that experience with asking questions to people. That’s an awesome point, Erica.

All right, so to wrap it up, if you have any advice or anything for, or any suggestions for somebody listening who might be considering applying for an internship or becoming a mentor, what is something you’d you tell them or what is something you tell your past self as some advice for stepping into this role?

Alec (25:44) I’ll let Doris and Cole talk about the internship side, because I have not been an intern for a very long time and I wasn’t one at GitHub. But I will say that regarding being a mentor, tips for that would be to picture what it’s like to be a mentee.

understand the other side and think about what you would like as a mentor. What would you like your mentor to be like? And then try to be that. I think that’s the best advice I can give in any leadership role, honestly, because it essentially is about leading. And one of the best quotes or sayings about leading and mentorship is

you’re still a student as well. Like teachers and students, you’re still a student as a teacher and like leaving room for learning as a mentor is really important as well. So I definitely learned a lot this summer. Also Gen Z slang, they taught me a lot of Gen Z slang. So that got me in, in with that, which was, which was good. But I’ve said enough.

Cole (26:44) Yeah, I think to be honest, what’s going through everyone’s heads as an intern is, am I gonna come back? Like, will I get a return offer? And people do, people try to do the best job and do the most work to get a return offer. So I feel like that’s absolutely doing the work for the wrong reason. And you’re not going to have fun doing it that way. And you know, I’ve…

We were just in SF talking to other interns and you know, 99 % of the conversations are, what do you think about return offers, return offers? And you can clearly see the stress and the fatigue that people have from thinking about this. But I think if you allow yourself to kind of just not worry about it and do the work for other reasons like self growth and growth mindset and progression in your engineering career in general and your skills, then.

you’ll have a much greater time and you’ll do much, better work and you’ll be more fulfilled in the end. So don’t worry too much is my advice, guess.

Doris Wang (27:40) Yeah, I think in terms of applying for internships, especially when you’re going through behavioral interviews, think being your authentic self is like, I mean, I think that’s a common advice, but I think it’s really important because like,

how you will like your experience, it’s really related to how you fit, your vibe fits with the company. And I think at least for GitHub, it was really important. The behavioral was really important to kind of scope out the vibe of the interns and like…

And I think that our vibe, matching the company culture, is a big part of us enjoying our experience. And I would also say, going into an internship, having an open mindset about, you’re not only there to learn technical skills or do a lot of work, you’re there to meet a lot of new mentors and understand other engineers’

learn just different ways to problem solve from different more senior engineers and also to scope out your career. Even if you’re coming in as an engineering intern, I think it’s still good to talk to people that are in the PM space, where only customer success and kind of understand just the different career paths that you have and not just lock in and heads down to your code. But yeah, I think like…

just being super open-minded and like, yeah, being your authentic self.

Cole (29:05) Yeah, I kinda wanna add on to that, cause that’s a great point. I think it’s very easy to want to try to act like the person that you think they want you to be, and that ties into being your authentic self. And that’s definitely not gonna work out for a lot of reasons. And I think a good way to put it that we heard about recently in one of the AMAs is if you are presenting or you’re talking to someone that you wanna impress or something,

you can be yourself plus 25%. So that means be yourself, amp up your energy. Think about your responses more, but don’t try to be someone that you’re not. That’s just, that’s not gonna work out. And ultimately, whether you enjoy or want to come back here, it’s all about how you fit into the company culture.

Erika (29:45) I feel like I have learned so much from this discussion, not only about your experiences, but all of your thought processes and what an enlightening, enlightening discussion it’s been with all of you. We are going to wrap up with a fun segment. Hopefully this is fun for you. And sort of a, can be a non sequitur of like the strict developer focus.

but thinking about if you could be mentored by anyone for one month in anything, what would it be and why? And I can start by kicking this off because I’ve had time to think about this. And I think Alec knows this, but Cole and Doris, might not. I had a previous career as a musician, music teacher.

And someone I really admire is ⁓ Dolly Parton, specifically in songwriting. And if I could have a month being mentored by her in songwriting dream right there, would, yeah, I would find that incredibly inspiring.

Cole (30:47) I could go next. This is kind of an interesting answer, but I definitely, definitely would love to be mentored by my future self. I can’t think about how many times I always bring up to myself, wow, I wish I knew this a week ago, a month ago, a year ago. And yeah, I feel like I could steer myself in the right direction sometimes.

Doris Wang (31:06) Yeah, I love Cole’s answer, first of all. I was like, I wish I thought of that. But yeah, my answer is like a little bit boring, but it’s so like kind of similar to Cole’s. Just like anyone that is like currently in the career path that I want to go down. So like someone that’s an EM and like cares a lot about developer happiness and is like working on something that they’re really passionate about and thinks is really cool. Yeah, just someone who I can imagine.

myself to become.

Alec (31:36) those are both good answers. Yeah. I, I did with the amount of time I had to think about this, I’ll tell you the first person that came to mind. and I think it’s valid. ⁓ I would go with the answer that a lot of people would say, but I think Steve jobs would be a really cool mentor. people

He was definitely not loved by everyone. He was definitely like a contentious person, but I absolutely love to watch his keynotes on YouTube, like his old ones. They’re just like so interesting to me. And I would particularly like to be mentored on just his public speaking ability, like how he’s able to like capture an entire room and like really get people onto his vision. Regardless of

whether people think he’s a good person or not. ⁓ I think that he did some amazing things and I would like that skill. So that’s my answer.

Bethany (32:26) Everyone has such great answers, my gosh, like big brain answers.

I think mine went a little more niche. There’s somebody who goes to GopherCon a lot and gives talks and used to be on the Go team, I believe, if not just Google in general, Rebecca Stambler, but she just has such a great way of doing technical storytelling and clearly has such a depth of knowledge. I would love to just even a day pick her brain about her skill set and how she goes about things and thinks through things because I really admire it.

and love every talk I’ve seen from her. So that would be mine.

Brittany Ellich (33:02) Love that. I’ll round it out. I also have a slightly different take on this. I love everybody’s answers so far. I think that if I were to choose anybody, this is probably actually the most achievable of these, but I would pick Sarah Vessels, who is one of the staff engineers here at GitHub. I just recently reread her blog post about code reviews and it was just so good. And she is one of like the smartest humans I’ve known and the most compassionate code reviewer. And I would love to just, you know, spend more time learning from her.

I’m totally going to tell her that I said that too.

Erika (33:32) Maybe we can get her on the pod. I don’t know, all your gopher con connections too, Brittany, we might be able to get some some big hitters from the space on here. And yeah, well, thank you all so much for this discussion and thank you listeners for tuning in to Overcommitted. If you like what you hear, please do follow, subscribe, or do whatever it is you like to do on the pod.

Brittany Ellich (33:35) That’d be awesome.